The Irish psyche is a deep topic for a blog post on the day after St. Patrick’s Day, when many facets of said psyche were on display all over the world.
As I did a little research for this post I came across a quotation attributed to the father of psychoanalysis himself, Sigmund Freud.
In the movie The Departed, Matt Damon’s character claims that Freud said:
“This is one race of people for whom
psychoanalysis is of no use whatsoever.”
~ Sigmund Freud (about the Irish)
Some claim this Freudian quotation was derived from a phrase by one of his followers. This student of Freud claimed that the Irish, when in psychic trouble go to poetry, go to storytelling, or to escapism. He believed the Irish have no interest in picking apart their own brains.
Freud is also claimed to have stated that the Irish are a mass of contradictions and impervious to the rational thought processes that might resolve them.
And finally another follower of Freud supposedly said the Austrian doctor categorized people as “Irish and non-Irish.”
Whether or not Freud actually said these words, we may never know. However it seems clear that the Irish psyche was at some point a topic of conversation for this famous psychiatrist and his students.
The real question for me is why Freudians were so intrigued by the Irish psyche?
What characteristics of the Irish people led them to these conclusions?
What exactly did Freud mean?
Was it said as an insult, a compliment or neither?
My proud Irish side wants to answer by saying we are too fine tuned to benefit from inward thinking, or perhaps we are just too complex for analysis.
But then there is my down-to-earth, practical Irish side that realizes we don’t do psycho anything very well. We hate to share our emotions, we are ridden with guilt, and believe life’s fleeting fortunes are precursors to inevitable doom and gloom.
Let’s face it, no psychoanalyst is getting inside my Irish head – there’s barely enough room for my thoughts in here.
Irish people are stubbornly polite. Saying what we think is difficult at times, but then in complete contrast there are times when we can’t stop talking and saying exactly what we think. We are a mass of contradictions.
Words that come to mind to describe our nature are stubborn, humble, explosive, friendly, bad-tempered, humorous, hardassed and artistic. See what I mean? A mass of contradictions.
And so this got me thinking about all the factors which helped form our elusive Irish psyche over the centuries.
Is their something about our Irishness begging to be explored?
Is there a story of Irish psychological development crying out to be told?
What is it about the Irish and our personality that makes us different and possibly unique?
Why did so many Irish succeed in America?
Do we really put the FUN in DYSFUNCTIONAL?
Can Irish proverbs help us better understand our collective psyche?
And so I decided why not create a section on my blog dedicated to discussing the Irish psyche.
But am I qualified to talk about this topic authoritatively? Not in the least. Pychoanalysis is definitely not my realm of expertise. My degrees are in physical health and well being. But why let that stop me. I’m going to take on the topic of the Irish psyche in true narcissistic, Freudian fashion.
I may not hold any psychology credentials but I have been educated in the school of life on both sides of the Atlantic, helping me to develop my own opinion of the Irish psyche. I may not be able to personally answer all of these questions, but I can moderate a good discussion, and together who knows what insights and stories we may discover.
So stay tuned for more interesting posts on the Irish Psyche.
Slán agus beannacht,
(Goodbye and blessings)
Irish American
If you enjoyed this introduction to the Irish Psyche, then here are some other posts you might find interesting …
The Irish – A Superstitious Race
Thou Shalt Not Blow Your Own Trumpet
Irish Catholic Guilt
I’ll look forward to this series of posts. I always enjoy reading your stories and your unique way of looking at things and exploring our Irishness.
Thanks so much Sheila. I hope you’ll join in the discussion as we delve into the Irish Psyche.
All the best,
Mairéad
I don’t think you did much research and have to assume you did not see “The Departed.” In the film, Matt Damon’s character asks his date, a psychiatrist, if she knows what Freud said about the Irish. He then states “We are the only people who are impervious to psychoanalysis.” The screenplay writer said he paraphrased a quote attributed to Freud, which is the one you erroneously attributed to Damon’s character in the film.
Liz – Thanks so much for clarifying this. My wording and layout are not very clear in this post. The quote I highlighted is the one attributed to Freud, not meant to be a direct quotation from the movie. I’m so glad you were able to add the exact words spoken by Matt Damon’s character in the movie.
All the best,
Mairéad
How did you answer her so politely?
I read this comment differently to how you may have read it, and took it as a misunderstanding of the quotations I used. I genuinely appreciate all readers’ input into our discussions on the infamous Irish psyche, once they show respect to other readers.
Take care, and thanks for checking out this post.
Mairéad
A perfect example of unexpected politeness…:D
By the way I just started googling on the Irish psyche and this is the first link I clicked on.
Thanks for your kind words, Jack and for stopping by to check out this post.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
I noted that too but didn’t comment because…I’m irish 😉
That’s funny, Rita. We don’t always speak up – it’s an Irish thing. Thanks for checking out this post.
Take care,
Mairéad
She was able to do this because correcting someone does not imply that they are stupid or feeble minded. Reacting poorly would only suggest that she is irrational especially defending a rumor. Play chess, it will help 🙂
Hi Sean – I certainly won’t become irrational over what is definitely only a rumor about a Freudian quotation. Thanks for reading through these comments. I think they’re the most interesting and informative part of this post.
All the best,
Mairéad
Wondering the same myself!
Thanks for stopping by, Marie Lee.
All the best,
Mairéad 🙂
Google it Liz
Freud never said this , if you find it actually quoted by Freud I owe you a black & tan ! I personally believe we are impervious to psychoanalysis we are a strong race of people I’ve been blessed with Viking blood mixed with my Irish blood now let’s talk impervious !
Doc – Freud probably never said these exact words. Ever since he was attributed with the line in “The Departed”, it has become a topic of interest for many, whether fact or fiction. No matter who first started the discussion about the Irish being impervious to psychoanalysis, there is some truth in this idea. As you so aptly point out we are a strong race of people. We Irish deal with life in our own unique way. Thanks for stopping by and adding to our discussion.
All the best,
Mairead
Well, I don’t know about Freud, but the one counselor that I visited told me I care too much about my family’s well being – especially my mom’s. I prefer to be impervious to that type of advice. It amuses me to think we’re a mess of contradictions to others when we are so predictable to ourselves.
I think the one thing that defines me, and many other Irish-American ladies is this: I panic when I don’t have a perfectly pressed, seasonally appropriate wake and funeral outfit ready to go at all times. The thought of shopping while grieving completely overwhelms me.
Hi Linda – You made me laugh with your confession that you always have a perfectly pressed wake and funeral outfit ready to go at all times. That truly is an Irish thing. I have my dependable black suits – one for summer and one for winter wear, just in case. Attending funerals is so much part of our Irish culture.
Thanks so much for stopping by and adding your perspective to our discussion of the Irish psyche. I believe many Irish women could be told they care too much about their mother’s well being – but I don’t see that as a bad thing at all. It’s part of who we are. I am very proud of the deep seated respect, and love I have for my mother, and my entire family.
Take care and enjoy the rest of your weekend.
Mairéad
There is no proof Freud said that, that may or may not be the same as he never said it. There is no proof of a lot in this world, but what is true, is true. There is no proof, who cares, s there is no proof he didn’t say it either. One must learn the power of suggestion that others use to influence the truth, especially when they got an agenda. Ask yourself who first said there is no proof, and why they said that, then you can find the truth.
Hi Wade – Thanks for your input on finding proof and truth. Who knows if Freud actually said these words, but it is a great discussion point.
Thanks for stopping by and checking out this blog post.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
Regardless of who actually stated it first, seems to be the truth!! Doesn’t take a degree to see that!! Much love and blessings to all!!
Blessings to you too, Tim. Thanks for checking out my ramblings.
Mairéad
This is a fascinating subject! My husband said I am exactly like my Mom, Worry that there is nothing to worry about! Will be looking forward to your ideas.
Thank you so much for answering my email…now I see where to follow you… I really enjoy your site.
Thanks so much for following Pat. Funny – my husband also tells me I am getting more like my Mom as I get older. As we say in Ireland “an ounce of breeding is worth a tonne of feeding.” Have a wonderful week.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
There are so many typical Irish traits perfect for discussion. From our love of a good chat, to not getting too big for our boots, we all have learned these Irish ways from our elders. I’ll watch out for your posts.
Thanks Mary. I hope you enjoy this series.
All the best,
Mairéad
Hi Mairead, Hmm couldn’t have anything to do with the history of Ireland, farmers, sailors, and nomads who at different times had to deal with Vikings, Normans, British, but surviving it all to fight another day. You would know better than I.
Cheers,
Brian.
Brian – That sums it up beautifully. Surviving it all is what made us what we are today. Hope you had a lovely St. Patrick’s Day.
All the best,
Mairéad
Well done Mairead.Frank Mc Court sums it up pretty much for me ‘So much going on in my head’ more professionally termed ‘Flight of ideas’.Have often thought if we could delete the useless information & download more into another file look at the space we could create.Loved the quotes esp Yeates .I will add an Oscar Wilde ‘Learning to love yourself is the start of a life long romance’
Love Anne
Dear Anne – That is a great quote from Oscar Wilde. I like how Frank McCourt sums it up too. I think we will have many more posts to really get into the nuances of the Irish psyche. Thanks so much for checking this one and adding to the discussion.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
Ha! That could really explain some things. Contradictions? That doesn’t even begin to explain it. Shop around. You may or may not enjoy my Irish madness
http://eatgrueldog.wordpress.com/2013/03/18/lost-irish-soul/
Jay -Thanks for stopping by. An intertwined mass of contradictions and deep convictions – the Irish spirit or madness or whatever it is may be beyond our explanation, but I can see that we are both going to do our best to try to explain it. I checked out your beautiful, open verse poem – “Lost Irish Soul”. Thanks for sharing this link. You captured the spirit of your friend in eloquent, memorable words – a truly heart-warming and touching piece.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
Thank you. I will be back to visit. In addition to your writings, I will be back for recipes. Regards
Thanks, Jay. I hope you enjoy some of my traditional Irish cooking.
All the best,
Mairéad
When and who Freud was dealing with would prevent the Irish from being a patient. The angst in Vienna in the years from 1850 to 1950 was based around the emerging middle class and the only Irish he would’ve encountered would have been Jesuits, Bishops and the like. Extremely wealthy Papal knights and the remnants of the wild geese who fit rather well into the aristocratic life of the Austro-Hungarian polity. In other words the very class that would never have gone near Freud.
So true Vince. He may also have formed some of his opinions of the Irish during his time spent in London, being influenced by a less than favorable attitude towards the Irish by those around him. Conjecture on my part, I know, but could well have been the case.
Thanks again for adding to our discussion.
Mairéad
Hmm, perhaps. But that tosses up a new one. Which cohort of Irish was he on about.
At the lower, East End irish and jews were allies. And at the top, like in NYC, the money men were allies too. But again it’s doubtful if in either camp would they be telling their deepest. Nor I expect would what he defined as a problem be seen in those terms. For the most, the rich went off to wild places and shot something if they were feeling a bit poorly.
More great insights, Vince. I don’t know which class of Irish he may have been referring to, but I think we can rest assured that no Irish person was going to open up to Freud or one of his associates, no matter what socioeconomic group he or she belonged to.
All the best,
Mairéad
Wonderful to have stumbled upon your blog, Mairéad. My story isn’t so different from many, many others. We’re undeniably Irish; the Conroy, O’Roarke and Halliday relatives bear witness to the connection to Ireland that is with me always. Unfortunately, the family tree was sundered long ago; my fraternal grandfather was an orphan. Consequently, we cannot say for sure if “Matthews” is a birth name or an adoptive name. So far, even DNA testing hasn’t yielded clues. sláinte.
Ed – Welcome to my little corner of the web, where we celebrate all things Irish and Irish American. Thanks so much for checking out my posts and for letting us know about your family’s immigrant tale. I think many young children were orphaned during the 19th and early 20th century when they first came to America, or tragically separated from their families. One reader even told me how her father lost his brother on the crowded streets of New York City and they never again found each other. These heart wrenching stories make me realize how fortunate we are today, and how limited our understanding of our ancestors’ struggles is. Above all else I admire their determination and tenacity. Family research is difficult in the face of such historical hurdles. I wish you every success as you continue your search for the Matthews branch of your family tree.
Best wishes, and thanks so much for stopping by.
Mairéad
I smiled when i started reading this blog, inthat way that only an outsider could , my grandparents left Dublin in !916 to live in England , i returned 25 years ago for a short stay and never left. Setting up a small business i found dealing with my kindred to be the most frustrating part of this process yes meant maybe or even no, arrangements and agreements made were at times vauge and nebulas, the Irish attitude made me want to scream, reading your take on the Irish psyche will be both informative and perhaps liberating as i look for my hidden gael
Andrew – I’m glad you appreciate my take on the Irish psyche. I think it is only when we move away from Ireland, or return from another country, that we truly come to appreciate the little nuances of character that make us uniquely Irish. Some traits are definitely frustrating, but others make us what we are. Thanks for stopping by. I hope you enjoy my future posts on the infamous Irish psyche.
All the best,
Mairead
A local (Dublin Ohio) town is about to have an Irish festival that we like attending. Looking at the web site for info on the upcoming events I looked up the http://dublinirishfestival.org/celtic-canines, Irish Terrier.
When I read about the temperament of this dog I remembered your piece here and had to share. It
seems even the dogs have this same lively, live life to it’s fullest personalitiy. Is it the land itself that has
taught us this way?
Thanks Penny for a great link with wonderful information about all these Irish dog breeds. Last year I took my kids to a Celtic Festival across the Ohio River in Clarkesville, Indiana. My kids were enthralled by an Irish wolf hound. All these Irish dogs are wonderful breeds, with great personality. Love them all.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
We fell from stars and landed light, on the green meadows of the emerald isle.
Had we known then the trials that would meet us and the hunger for freedom and food that
would savage our souls, we would of died on arrival.
As it stands we stayed and endured,and suffered, and used humour to shield us
from pain, and anger to shield us from fear.
We as a people are the ultimate contradiction.
Beautifully stated, Daniel. Thanks so much for summing up our Irishness so succinctly.
All the best,
Mairéad
i live in wicklow, have you ever been?
where are your people from?
Daniel – My parents are from Cork, but I grew up in Dublin. I have very fond memories of visiting Bray, Greystones, Glendalough, Powerscourt, and Avondale as a child. You are lucky to live in Wicklow, one of Ireland’s most beautiful counties.
Take care,
Mairéad
I have not been back home (Mallow) for fifteen tears (not a typo). Love your wee site.
Dear Denis – Thank you so much for visiting my site and checking out my ramblings. My father’s family hail from Kildorrery just a few miles from Mallow. North Cork is a beautiful part of the world. I hope when you revisit Ireland and your hometown of Mallow after all these years, your experiences will bring you tears of joy.
Best wishes for a very happy and peaceful New Year.
Mairéad
Any statement that begins ” the Irish are all” is inevitably going to be racist. The presumption that Irish people are beyond psychological analysis is tiresome racism at it’s best. Along with the old hackneyed idea that Irish people are somehow suffering guilt more than any other group. Modern Ireland is a multicultural society, very much wanting to be recognised as the equal to any other in the world. Irish people have had to put up with horrendous stereotyping for centuries. (“The Irish are all pigs” – princess Anne, the queen of England’s sister!) Please refrain from perpetrating such nonsense. Ireland is a peaceful country, one of the few nations of the world that has actually managed to overcome its extraordinary difficulties with a deeply aggressive neighbour, often intent on nothing less than genocide. Read your history. For such a small country, we have given a lot to the cultural enrichment of the planet. Oh, and we never tried to take over the world.
Sean – Thanks so much for adding to this discussion. I appreciate your viewpoint and insights into these stereotypes of old.
Best wishes,
Mairéad
The reason we Irish are beyond pyschoanalysis has nothing to do with our contradictions, guilt or tendancy when in psychic trouble go to poetry, go to storytelling, or to escapism. It’s because 600 years of occupation by the culturally “superior” British and the spiritually “superior” Roman Catholic church caused a mutation in the Irish genome which is passed on to Irish children through their mammys X-chromosome. This gene, named BS101 is now present in 99.6% of the Irish population. People with this mutation have shown a 57% increase in the ability to smell and detect bullshit and bullshitters at a range up to 20 meters. A good example of this gene in action would be Oscar Wilde who called bullshit on many things, Bertie Ahern is an example of someone who can use this ability to not only detect bullshit but also produce some of the finest bullshit in human history.
What has this got to do with psychoanalysis? Simple, Freud was full of shit, Jung was full of shit (and mildly insane himself) and all psychologists since are inherently and largely unintentionally full of shit. How can you pretend to understand something ( human consciousness) that science cant even begin to describe, well, you can if you are full of shit and you want to be rich,powerful, loved by many ( this is why most Irish people hate Bono) and like to tell people how they should live their lives. Freud couldn’t understand this about the Irish because to do so would have destroyed his world-view and undoubtedly led to many years of expensive psychotherapy.
P.s. This text contains a test to determine if the reader is a carrier of the BS101 gene. If you wish to find out if you have the gene all you have do is find the hidden test in the text, if you can find the test the you you have the gene and your definitely Irish.
Peter – It sounds like I’d need a PhD. (with B…S… piled high and deep) to answer that one.
All the best,
Mairead
Male of Irish decent with all blood lines from Ireland. My siblings and I have all bastardized the lines but we are Americans now.I am 47, married 19 years, 2 children, Daughter, 18 in just 6 days & my Son 13 this past July. My wife is as beautiful as the day I met her and my children are both healthy and smart. Their home is bought and paid for. I have done the best I can do with the tools I was given. Time and abuse has given illness its opening to my body. I’m not ready to be done but I have little ability to believe my OWN BULL SHIT any longer. I laugh at my wife who said to see a psychologist. Sure I let my daughter go, but only because she has my wife’s blood. Christ I even let her try them pills… I was so happy when my daughter concurred. “I”d rather think like a loon than have no thought at all” I told my little girl before she began her dose. A month later we said good-bye to the PSYCHIATRIST! She still talks with her friend the psychologist. I told her that all the pain she burdens will someday make her the person she WILL BECOME….. That she understood, but not a Doctor? So I labor in my mind trying to figure out……Who do I bullshit in my time of need? My self or my family? How about the doctors and my organs??? Well, I guess I’ll listen to some music and let the wee people decide…. I love Being IRISH!
Sweemey – I am so glad to hear that you love being Irish. Wishing you and your family health and happiness.
All the best,
Mairéad
Sweeney wins “Best comment!” 😂😂
Thanks for reading through the comments. This post has generated quite a discussion on the Irish Psyche.
All the best,
Mairéad
I love your funny & candid post! Read early AM & a great start to me Day. However I have to admit… U2’s my fav band. My dream is to see them play @ Croake Park in Dublin. Bono rocks & we accidentally ran into The Bloody Sunday monument in Derry, N. Ireland when traveling around the Beautiful North part of Eire’. What happened to me there was amazing & enlightening.
It was a week after the Orange Man March & our B & B guy said we were safe. What a fascinating trip. Been all over the World & luvvvvv Ireland. It’s magical both North & South. 😉 ?
Hi Patty – I saw U2 in Croke Park many, many years ago. I brought my cousin and younger sister, when they were both young teenagers. They’re both in their forties now, but they still thank me for taking them to see U2 in Dublin. So glad you had such a meaningful trip to Derry.
Take care and please stop by my little corner of the world wide web whenever you have a moment.
Mairéad
I have always been fascinated by my Irish heritage and how it ties into my own personality traits. References made to the Irish & psychoanalysis have further peaked my interest into our culture. I look forward to learning more.
Michael – I’m glad you found this little piece interesting. It truly is an intriguing topic. I’m not an expert in psychology, but over the coming weeks and months I’ll write about some Irish personality traits I’ve become more aware of, simply by living in the United States.
All the best,
Mairead
Being a fan of Scorcese films, I was especially fond of this one in particular, due to my Irish-American heritage. I found this idea very interesting as I was unfamiliar with it at the time. But, being an American, raised around many different ethnic groups, I try not to generalize any type of people. However, I do agree that there is something mysterious, if not, magical about the Irish people as a race.